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Thread: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

  1. #1
    Tim Wroblewski
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    Default Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi,

    A client has recently purchased a new Windows 8 Dell Latitude 10 tablet to use ArcGIS for Windows Mobile on. Now I know that strictly speaking the official line is that ArcGIS for Windows Mobile is not supported on Windows 8 at present. However, we have it up and running on another client's tablet also running Windows 8. The difference between these two devices is the GPS configuration:-
    • The device we have it working on is using an external GPS plugged in via USB which is being connected to by ArcGIS for Windows Mobile using a virtual COM port.
    • The new tablet from Dell has a built in Broadcom GNSS location sensor with GPS capabilities. However, it is configured to work with the OS via the Windows sensor/location (Not sure which one) API and as such, is not visible to the ArcGIS for Windows Mobile application which requires a COM port to connect to a GPS.

    I guess I have two questions:-
    • Has anyone mangaged to get ArcGIS for Windows Mobile to connect to a GPS using the Windows sensor/location API?
    • If not, then does anyone know how to create a virtual COM port which relays the data from the built-in Broadcom GNSS location sensor via the Windows sensor/location API?

    I really appreciate any time that people are able to put towards helping me out! I'm a little but stuck!

    Thanks,

    Tim

  2. #2
    Ken Senter
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    We're wondering this too. We just bought a Dell Latitude 10 Tablet specifically to use ArcPad on it and we haven't been able to get it to work so far. I'm really confused right now whether it's a problem with the specific device in the tablet, the Broadcom BCM47511 GPS, or whether it's due to the way Windows 8 handles GPS devices.

    Based on this it sounds like it's because Windows 8 has changed the way GPS is used to go through an API:
    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/For...8-33c573a6a22d

    But here you can see that they claim ArcPad and Windows 8 are "a beautiful marriage":
    http://arcpadteam.blogspot.com/2013/...-marriage.html

    But then in the comments of that blog post you can see that people aren't having much luck getting it to work...

    Can someone help clear up what the problem is and whether there is likely to be a solution. We're trying to decide whether to return the tablet...

    Thanks so much!

  3. #3
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    All,

    Esri doesn't currently have Dell Latitude 10 tablet to test GPS connectivity within ArcPad or ArcGIS for Windows Mobile applications yet a test unit is on the way and we hope to test these reported behaviors as well as pre-established ArcGIS standard testing scenarios.

    Furthermore, Esri Support has actively researched these reports and found recent additions to Dell's Driver Download site including Dell BIOS uploaded 2/1/2013 and Dell Driver for Broadcom BCM47511 Standalone GPS Solution
    http://www.dell.com/support/drivers/...eId=3094635676 and then follow the instructions in Dell Support article #117682: Set Up, Use & Troubleshooting GPS Using the Dell Location & GPS Utility (unsure if this helps your situation, but need someone w/Latitude 10 tablet to test and report findings).

    Recommend Dell Latitude 10 tablet owners visit Dell Drivers & Downloads and install applicable driver updates after determining updated driver is needed from steps in Dell Support Document #266495: How to get the Latest Driver Updates for your Dell. Suggest subscribing to Dell Technical Emails via Dell Driver Download Manager FAQs for latest updates.

    Please follow this post for more information,
    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  4. #4
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Additionally, I should have stated that this is a hardware issue and normally falls to the hardware manufacturer (Dell) to provide the fix, typically as a driver which is why I'm hoping my previous post to the GPS standalone driver download helps to resolve this issue for Dell Latitude 10 tablet owners; see GPS receiver’s manual for information on how to set the output GPS protocol and port communication parameters on the GPS receiver. It's not a software issue as both ArcPad and ArcGIS for Windows Mobile simply use the same GPS communication parameters set on your GPS receiver. However, Esri's Mobile & Support Teams want to assist Dell Latitude 10 tablet owners in being able to run ArcPad & ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with complete GPS functionality.

    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

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    Andrew Sanchez Meador
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    So I'm the person from Northern Arizona University that posted on the Arcpad blog and I'm still looking/hoping for a solution for this... as these tablets are pretty sweet.

    and Denise, My bios is up to date, I've downloaded the "standalone solution" and followed the instructions included in the .zip file (repeatedly) and have yet to get this GPS to be recognized by ArcPad. I've also combed Broadcom's website for a manual and have yet to find one, there or on the internet in general. So for now, I guess that means changing the output GPS protocol and port communication parameters is a no go.

    However, I have been able to write code that can play nice with the geolocator api in vb.net, c++ and c# and have even been able to build examples that log data to a text file. Not elegant and I would never put it in the hands of my students, but it gets the job done and was a simple proof of concept.

    Andrew

  6. #6
    Andrew Sanchez Meador
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    A couple of additional thoughts.. I've tested a few external GPS units with the Latitude 10 and ArcPad via the one USB port on the device and Bluetooth, and they work great.

    As I see it, this is not an issue with traditional GPS devices but rather one associated with the way newer devices (tablets, phones, etc) have integrated gps into their hardware.

    To me, it seems to be one of two solutions: a) Dell or Broadcom needs to provide a user-level device driver (UMDF) that will allow sensor api-dependent gps receivers to pass their NMEA stream to a port, so these integrated GNSS or GPS devices will work as other, more traditional (ie.d, port-based) devices or b) ArcPad needs to be able to look for devices on ports and the sensor API. Michael Chourdakis' TurboGPS has a good example of how this might work under it's GPS setup where can set the application up to use either com ports or the sensor API. For me , that's just another (albeit great) piece of software...

  7. #7
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Andrew,

    Thank you for the updated information and was sorry to hear the Broadcom standalone GPS didn't help to resolve the issue. Have you contacted Dell Support to ask if they have method of supporting COM port? You are correct in that Dell or Broadcom will need to provide Latitude 10 tablet customers with UMDF allowing Sensor API dependent GPS receivers to pass their NMEA stream to a COM port so that customers can configure the integrated GPS receiver with ArcGIS for Windows Mobile or ArcPad applications. This is because both the GPS library in the Runtime SDK for ArcGIS for Windows Mobile only supports NMEA GPS protocol and reads and parses GPS positions from a connected COM port. The COM port can be a physical serial port, a virtual COM port bound to a GPS receiver via Bluetooth or USB, or a program COM port attached to a GPS intermediate driver on Windows Mobile devices (on Windows Mobile 5.0 & newer systems).

    Esri Support and Mobile Teams will continue to test as resources permit and provide our test findings here. We highly encourage anyone encountering this roadblock to contact Dell and Broadcom Support for further assistance and request they provide UMDF GPS Driver for Latitude 10 tablets.

    Thank you,
    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  8. #8
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi All,

    We're experiencing this same problem (as are many others using legacy GPS/mapping software on Win 8) with our new Lenovo thinkpad Tablet 2's. Broadcom/Dell/Lenovo should be writing this bridge for legacy software (GNSS sensor to NMEA COM) but the mfgr's are simply following Window's guidance for handling location data. I can launch the "Maps App" and the "weather App" from the home screen and both pick up my location immediately. This says to me that an update to ArcPad is needed to bring the new Windows standard Location services into ArcPad. This is needed badly as we are ready to recommend this new approach to clients. I'm checking on broadcom drivers for windows 7 (if they exist) as a possible workaround. Looking forward to a fix.

  9. #9
    Andrew Sanchez Meador
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    As requested, I had "our people talk to their people" and the response (slightly paraphrased) from Dell was...

    "Unfortunately this is a limitation of Windows 8 – it doesn't allow access to COM ports. This means that legacy applications that rely on this access will not work.” - awesome...

    The microsoft rep responding in this post seems to confirm Dell's assessment:
    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/For...-33c573a6a22d/

    At this point and unless told otherwise, I feel like I've exhausted all my options. The one last thing I may try (as suggested in that post) is I may just ask our IT folks to put our Win7 image on it and see where that takes me...

    As always, I'll keep everyone in the loop.

    Andrew

  10. #10
    Ken Senter
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by bi0m3trics View Post
    "Unfortunately this is a limitation of Windows 8 – it doesn't allow access to COM ports. This means that legacy applications that rely on this access will not work.” - awesome...
    This is actually not true for Windows 8, only Windows RT. See this thread:
    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/For...-6990c53e1652/

    We are currently using a bluetooth connected GPS on our Latitude 10 and it works just fine via a virtual com port.

    Edit: I should add that it also affects Windows 8's metro apps, they can't access com ports either, but desktop apps still can.
    Last edited by ksenter; 02-08-2013 at 07:58 AM.

  11. #11
    Andrew Sanchez Meador
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    That's great to know, but I'm not sure it moves us any closer to a solution. It's already been established that devices that connect via "physical serial port, a virtual COM port bound to a GPS receiver via Bluetooth or USB, or a program COM port attached to a GPS intermediate driver on Windows Mobile devices (on Windows Mobile 5.0 & newer systems)" work fine, as they interact with the ESRI's GPS library in the expected fashion. The focus here (based on the original post) is these integrated devices that utilize direct calls to the Location API...

    We for one, bought the tablet because it has an internal reciever and the prospect of connecting anything external somewhat defeats the purpose...

  12. #12
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Agree completely with buying tablets because of internal GPS.

    After some searching it looks like there are several products out there that pull the GPS COM into Windows location service. There are none that do the opposite. I've talked to a developer friend who seems to think it's possible to dump the NMEA string from the location service into a virtual COM. We may have to pay for a custom solution on this. I'll update if it is resolved.

    On the other hand looking at some "updated" legacy GPS programs on Windows 8 there are solutions to hook into this data. See TurboGPS for windows. After insall you can connect via "windows API" checkbox. I don't see how this isn't possible through a patch in ArcPAD/Mobile 10 from ESRI's side.

    For now we'll be having to use BT or USB GPS devices.... Frusterating.

  13. #13
    Ken Senter
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by bi0m3trics View Post
    That's great to know, but I'm not sure it moves us any closer to a solution. It's already been established that devices that connect via "physical serial port, a virtual COM port bound to a GPS receiver via Bluetooth or USB, or a program COM port attached to a GPS intermediate driver on Windows Mobile devices (on Windows Mobile 5.0 & newer systems)" work fine, as they interact with the ESRI's GPS library in the expected fashion. The focus here (based on the original post) is these integrated devices that utilize direct calls to the Location API...

    We for one, bought the tablet because it has an internal reciever and the prospect of connecting anything external somewhat defeats the purpose...
    Agreed. I was just pointing out that Dell's response is inaccurate. They (or Broadcom) could supply a driver that uses a virtual Com port, Windows 8 doesn't prevent them from doing so.

  14. #14
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Esri Support and Mobile GIS Teams will soon have Dell Latitude 10 and Lenovo Thinkpad 2 tablets onsite for our own testing of these reported issues. Yet, I've been This is actually not true for Windows 8, only Windows RT. In the meantime, please see these updated Microsoft Forum thread on GPS & COM ports: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/...1-292096b46131

    Please continue to update your findings as Esri is greatly interested in these new Windows 8 Pro challenges ArcPad and ArcGIS for Windows Mobile users have encountered.

    Thank you,
    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  15. #15
    Tim Wroblewski
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi,

    Its great to see others are having the same issues with their Dell Latitude tablets and that its not just me. I don't have any further updates to the situation other than that I've had similar responses from Dell and ESRI to others on here. Any updates from you Denise on the time frame we can expect to get a working copy of ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with Windows 8 and these new GPS chips would be great.

    Many thanks,

    Tim

  16. #16
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Esri Support update on Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Windows 8 Pro OS testing:

    there are 2 diff models of Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Win 8 Pro tablets - one w/GPS & Mobile broadband & one without
    Click image for larger version

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    Esri Support has both models & you can see in screenshots of expanded Device Manager list that GPS model on left includes Ports (COM & LPT) as we specified during purchasing ThinkPad 2 tablet we needed integrated GPS
    * Sierra Wireless Gobi NMEA GPS connection on COM4
    Click image for larger version

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    also listed in Device Manager is Sensors including Broadcom GNSS Gelocation Sensor yet Esri Support hasn't performed testing or further research into Sensors yet

    screenshot below is 2nd ThinkPad 2 tablet we have which doesn't include integrated GPS which is what I expect many of you have as well & which is likely reason you are unable to connect to GPS functionality within ArcPad or ArcGIS for Windows Mobile applications as both ArcPad and ArcGIS for Windows Mobile both state in documentation they require COM port to connect to GPS functionality.
    Click image for larger version

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    found similar reports with other GPS software applications & variety of Win 8 Pro tablets, see http://forums.toshiba.com/t5/Satelli...5t/td-p/346208

    Will continue to update with ArcPad & ArcGIS for Windows Mobile testing going forward, as time permits.
    Denise

    linking to related ArcPad Forum thread on similar topic - http://forums.arcgis.com/threads/770...143#post276143
    Last edited by Denise62; 02-26-2013 at 06:08 AM. Reason: linking to related forum thread
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

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    Frederic Pelletier
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi,

    Since a COM Port is available on the model with "integrated GPS" option, I understand that ArcGIS and ArcPad will works.

    There a few tools on the market that supports redirecting NMEA stream to any kind of ports (physical, virtual, TCP/IP), GPSGate (Franson) is a example (great tool !).

    Is there any plan on ESRI roadmap to make ArcPad or Mobile compatible with at least a TCP/IP port or ideally implement the support for the new GeoLocation API (Microsoft)?

    Regards

    Frederic

  18. #18
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Denise,

    My apologies in terms of wasting your time on this "problem". As it turns out this broadcom chip in my Lenovo does not acually have a true GPS function as you stated. It instead has a location determined through Wifi that only works while connected. I only determined this by leaving any wifi connectivity. I have the non-broadband version of the tablet. That said, Lenovo is pushing this tablet as having GPS with no qualifiers or explanations. I had a long conversation with Lenovo about the problem with the way they were stating their specifications. Needless to say I'm walking away unhappy. I think I should mention as well that the Dell has the same chipset and likely has the same problem with their terminology. The dell owners may be stuck as I am with a device that won't do what is claimed. Thanks for the investigation and sorry again about the confusion caused by Lenovo.

  19. #19
    Ken Senter
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by Kopcz1nj View Post
    Denise,

    My apologies in terms of wasting your time on this "problem". As it turns out this broadcom chip in my Lenovo does not acually have a true GPS function as you stated. It instead has a location determined through Wifi that only works while connected. I only determined this by leaving any wifi connectivity. I have the non-broadband version of the tablet. That said, Lenovo is pushing this tablet as having GPS with no qualifiers or explanations. I had a long conversation with Lenovo about the problem with the way they were stating their specifications. Needless to say I'm walking away unhappy. I think I should mention as well that the Dell has the same chipset and likely has the same problem with their terminology. The dell owners may be stuck as I am with a device that won't do what is claimed. Thanks for the investigation and sorry again about the confusion caused by Lenovo.
    I don't know what chip your lenovo came with, but the BCM47511 which is in the Dell is true GPS. From Broadcom's website:
    "The BCM47511 is the latest generation of standalone GPS SoC solutions, adding GLONASS functionality, while remaining pin-compatible to the BCM4751 GPS SoC solution. The Broadcom® BCM47511 standalone GPS receiver and the Broadcom BCM2076 combo receiver with Bluetooth and an FM tuner feature dual constellation support of both GPS and GLONASS satellites. BCM47511 GPS receivers will have the ability to use an additional 21 GLONASS satellites currently (24 projected in the future), on top of the existing 30 U.S. GPS satellites, nearly doubling the number of satellites that can be used for navigation. In urban areas, many GPS satellites are blocked by buildings, so the additional 21 satellites offered by the GLONASS system will provide significant improvements in location performance and accuracy over currently available GPS receivers. The BCM47511 SoC solution is Broadcom's latest generation of standalone receiver, featuring both integrated GPS and GLONASS. Since it is pin-for-pin compatible with Broadcom's popular BCM4751 SoC solution, customers can quickly upgrade their products to include GLONASS navigation support."

    Speaking of which, I was digging through the driver from the Dell website and I noticed references to the BCM4751 and a driver called BcmGnssBus.sys which it says: BcmGnssBus.sys - ACPI/UART&GPIO Driver wrapper exposes ACPI/UART driver
    as COM22 for BcmGnss.dll
    Which to me sounds promising, but unfortunately I can't get my hands on the tablet. The guys using it need it every day. So I can't mess around with it anymore.

  20. #20
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by ksenter View Post
    I don't know what chip your lenovo came with, but the BCM47511 which is in the Dell is true GPS. From Broadcom's website:
    "The BCM47511 is the latest generation of standalone GPS SoC solutions, adding GLONASS functionality, while remaining pin-compatible to the BCM4751 GPS SoC solution. The Broadcom® BCM47511 standalone GPS receiver and the Broadcom BCM2076 combo receiver with Bluetooth and an FM tuner feature dual constellation support of both GPS and GLONASS satellites. BCM47511 GPS receivers will have the ability to use an additional 21 GLONASS satellites currently (24 projected in the future), on top of the existing 30 U.S. GPS satellites, nearly doubling the number of satellites that can be used for navigation. In urban areas, many GPS satellites are blocked by buildings, so the additional 21 satellites offered by the GLONASS system will provide significant improvements in location performance and accuracy over currently available GPS receivers. The BCM47511 SoC solution is Broadcom's latest generation of standalone receiver, featuring both integrated GPS and GLONASS. Since it is pin-for-pin compatible with Broadcom's popular BCM4751 SoC solution, customers can quickly upgrade their products to include GLONASS navigation support."

    Speaking of which, I was digging through the driver from the Dell website and I noticed references to the BCM4751 and a driver called BcmGnssBus.sys which it says: BcmGnssBus.sys - ACPI/UART&GPIO Driver wrapper exposes ACPI/UART driver
    as COM22 for BcmGnss.dll
    Which to me sounds promising, but unfortunately I can't get my hands on the tablet. The guys using it need it every day. So I can't mess around with it anymore.
    The lenovo does indeed have the BCM47511 and I did review the info on Broadcom's site. The only thing I can think is that the chip is a mediator betweeen the BCM4751 (no extra 1) and the system. Meaning the BCM4751 (GPS) is compatible but the BCM47511 does not actually catch the signal. I'm still in talks with Lenovo about the actual capability of this device. There is a possibility that I have a version that was shipped with a bad antenna but i'm thinking that's a slim possibility. I'll update as I learn more. Thanks for the input.

  21. #21
    Tim Wroblewski
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Just to let people know I've this morning tried the Dell Latitude 10 tablet with the latest version of ArcGIS for Windows Mobile (10.1.1) and I have still had no luck. This latest version of the software from ESRI still requires a COM port for communication with the GPS.

    Tim

  22. #22
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Some updates and some reading for those of us stuck with these devices/problems.

    It turns out that I have an Android tablet with the exact same chip as my Lenovo. It is definitely GPS enabeled (I used it to help test my Lenovo TP2). I'm still working my way through Lenovo tech support but no answers yet. I'm assuming the line will be that they're not supporting that function of the chip, but I'll update when I know more (in a week...).
    http://www.techrepublic.com/photos/c...6343522?seq=46

    Probably more interesting is this blog post from some Intel guy about programming for windows location API and determining where the signal is coming from. You programmers (or team ArcPad) out there might just be able to create a virtual COM from the location API and pass usable data to it with these guidelines.
    http://software.intel.com/node/326806

    For now, I've dug out my old Dell BT GPS's (or use my Android phone) to give me a location in the field, but it sure would be nice to have an all-in-one solution in the field someday from these devices.

  23. #23
    Ken Senter
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by ksenter View Post
    ...

    Speaking of which, I was digging through the driver from the Dell website and I noticed references to the BCM4751 and a driver called BcmGnssBus.sys which it says: BcmGnssBus.sys - ACPI/UART&GPIO Driver wrapper exposes ACPI/UART driver
    as COM22 for BcmGnss.dll
    Which to me sounds promising, but unfortunately I can't get my hands on the tablet. The guys using it need it every day. So I can't mess around with it anymore.
    So I happened to get my hand on the tablet again, and I see that the driver I mentioned above "BcmGnssBus.sys" is in fact installed under "System Devices" as "Broadcom GNSS Bus Driver". So that document I read earlier said it exposes the driver as COM22 for BcmGnss.dll. I did a search for BcmGnss.dll and I see it in "C:\Program Files\Broadcom\Location\BcmgnsslocationSensor\x86" along with the other driver files, but most interesting is an xml file that looks really interesting. In the xml file it talks about things like baud rate, port name, and the different jobs that can be performed by the GPS controller. I wish I knew more about this stuff, then I'd have an idea of what I'm looking at. Anybody with a Latitude 10 know more about this, and why it doesn't actually show up as com22?

  24. #24
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    I purchased two of the Dell Latitude 10's because after extensive researh they were the only ones who would stand behind thier products and claim to have full GPS capabilities. I am very frustrated having worked on it most of the day yesterday and having found this thread I am even more frustrated. I guess the only solution now is to buy some sort of blue tooth GPS or "puck" type device which utterly defeats the reason to buy the on-board GPS in the first place. Though i must say that I still paid $200 less than a Trimble Juno which has 10 x less screen real estate, and when they do (Dell of ESRI) get things worked out it will be a whole new experience with GPS navigation and data collection. We will still need survey grade for some things, but these do quite nicely as an in field information tool. Any feelings from the group what is the best route to solving this issue? Dell work-around, ESRI work around or some smart programmer coming up with a program? I wish I would have found this thread before i purchased my products but I'm grateful for all the awesome info!

  25. #25
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by ksenter View Post
    This is actually not true for Windows 8, only Windows RT. See this thread:
    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/For...-6990c53e1652/

    We are currently using a bluetooth connected GPS on our Latitude 10 and it works just fine via a virtual com port.

    Edit: I should add that it also affects Windows 8's metro apps, they can't access com ports either, but desktop apps still can.
    What are you guys running (hardware and software) to get your bluetooth to work? Is it working in ArcPad? I've tried both Garmin USB "Puck" and a Bluetooth version running on Fransom with no luck. I would settle for a USB/BT device, but haven't had any luck with either. Thanks for the info...

  26. #26
    Daniel Mallett
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    Unhappy Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi I'm having the exact same issue. The client is very excited about their new Dell Latitude tablets with built in GNSS however it can't communicate with ArcGIS for Windows Mobile.

  27. #27
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    I had the latitude 10 and I just sent them back and am ordering a lenovo to replace it. Hopefully those work better..

  28. #28
    Daniel Mallett
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by young_mossy View Post
    I had the latitude 10 and I just sent them back and am ordering a lenovo to replace it. Hopefully those work better..
    From what I understand the Lenovo has the same problem. I think the real solution here is for Esri to update the application to use Windows Location Services.

  29. #29
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Its a problem with windows 8 and its API. ArcPad and Mobile need to grab a COM port in order to read the data. The Dell only lists a sensor for the GPS unit in the device manager where Lenovo actually lists a COM port. I was on the phone with denise from ESRI last week and the lenovo they are testing actually is working.

  30. #30
    Paul Morrison
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by young_mossy View Post
    Its a problem with windows 8 and its API. ArcPad and Mobile need to grab a COM port in order to read the data. The Dell only lists a sensor for the GPS unit in the device manager where Lenovo actually lists a COM port. I was on the phone with denise from ESRI last week and the lenovo they are testing actually is working.
    I own a Lenovo with the Broadcom sensor and it does not have a COM port driver. However, the Sierra Wireless version appears to support the com port. It all boils down to which version and model number...

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    Dario Matta
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Hi,
    I have the same problem with a customer who bought a samsung smart ativ pc with the same broadcom chip that is written above.
    I had the same problem by developing an application with Arcgis Engine 10.
    The problem, as some of you have written, is due to Windows 8 and the change of access that makes the sensors. Even Arcgis Desktop installed on these computers has no way to display the GPS.

  32. #32
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMT View Post
    I own a Lenovo with the Broadcom sensor and it does not have a COM port driver. However, the Sierra Wireless version appears to support the com port. It all boils down to which version and model number...
    Where/how can we get the "Sierra Wireless" version of this machine?

  33. #33
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by young_mossy View Post
    Where/how can we get the "Sierra Wireless" version of this machine?
    Bill - you need to purchase the Mobile Broadband option with voice/data plan from wireless provider.

    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  34. #34
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Yea that's what I have on order, but I had never heard of the "Sierra Wireless" version and wondered if it was different than the one I had coming. Gave up on the Dell, hopefully this one will work out.

  35. #35
    Tim Wroblewski
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by Denise62 View Post
    Bill - you need to purchase the Mobile Broadband option with voice/data plan from wireless provider.

    Denise
    Quote Originally Posted by young_mossy View Post
    Yea that's what I have on order, but I had never heard of the "Sierra Wireless" version and wondered if it was different than the one I had coming. Gave up on the Dell, hopefully this one will work out.
    I'm in the process of giving up with Dell too - Just trying to negotiate the restocking fee down! Denise62 and young_mossy; are either of you ordering or ordered from Lenovo from the UK? When completing the online checkout process directly with Lenovo I have the option to select a 3G version of the tablet (See attached screen grab) but there is no mention of Sierra Wireless - Just an 'Integrated Mobile Broadband (Ericsson C5621)' - Will this version have a GPS built-in and, crucially, will it communicate with the OS and software installed via COM port?

    Many thanks,

    Tim

    Click image for larger version

Name:	Capture.JPG
Views:	234
Size:	116.3 KB
ID:	22431)
    Last edited by TCWhabitatINFO; 03-07-2013 at 02:57 AM. Reason: Attached screen grab

  36. #36
    Paul Morrison
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by Denise62 View Post
    Bill - you need to purchase the Mobile Broadband option with voice/data plan from wireless provider.
    Yes. I should have been more clear. The model with mobile broadband has the sierra adapater. I purchased the Wifi only model and it only has the Broadcom chipset.

  37. #37
    Daniel Mallett
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    Question Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    @Denise. Can you confirm that the GPS works with the Lenovo device and provide the model#, details, a link to the manufacturer's website, etc.

    Is the Sierra Wireless some type of external USB GPS you plug in or actually part of the tablet?

    Thanks.

  38. #38
    Bill Nelson
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by TCWhabitatINFO View Post
    I'm in the process of giving up with Dell too - Just trying to negotiate the restocking fee down! Denise62 and young_mossy; are either of you ordering or ordered from Lenovo from the UK? When completing the online checkout process directly with Lenovo I have the option to select a 3G version of the tablet (See attached screen grab) but there is no mention of Sierra Wireless - Just an 'Integrated Mobile Broadband (Ericsson C5621)' - Will this version have a GPS built-in and, crucially, will it communicate with the OS and software installed via COM port?

    Many thanks,

    Tim

    Attachment 22431)
    I'm ordering from the states, but I can tell you that I ordered mine from CDW-G, if you want to check with them..

  39. #39
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by dmallett View Post
    @Denise. Can you confirm that the GPS works with the Lenovo device and provide the model#, details, a link to the manufacturer's website, etc.

    Is the Sierra Wireless some type of external USB GPS you plug in or actually part of the tablet?

    Thanks.
    Was ordered through Esri Purchasing so no idea but used tech specs from Lenovo site directly & then specifically requested model w/internal GPS receiver & mobile broadband modem to support Esri's Mobile GIS software applications (ArcPad, ArcGIS for Windows Mobile, ArcMap using GPS Toolbar, ArcGIS Engine w/custom GPS library objects & multiple ArcGIS Runtime SDKs).

    Lenovo ThinkPad Tablet 2
    Machine Type Model 3682-2AU
    Serial# R9WN1VT

    In one of my posts above, I compare 2 Lenovo tablets we received: 1 w/GPS & 1 w/Sensors only. We easily connect w/GPS but cannot w/Sensors & this is because Esri's Mobile GIS software requires COM port to connect to GPS functionality and doesn't support the Sensors at this time available with new Windows 8 OS tablets.

    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  40. #40
    Denise King

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Everyone,

    Again, I return to Help documentation for all Esri software which states GPS connections require COM port to read and parse NMEA sentences from GPS receiver in ArcPad, ArcGIS for Windows Mobile and ArcMap's GPS Toolbar. However, I do encourage customers to POST the enhancement on ArcGIS Ideas site under Products category Mobile GIS > ArcPad. The ArcGIS Ideas is a submission portal which lets our customers get involved. You can suggest new products, promote favorite enhancements and interact with ESRI Teams. Or if already posted, VOTE for it and same for customers using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile and ArcMap's GPS Toolbar.

    Good luck,
    Denise
    Denise King
    Apps/Mobile Development Technical Lead
    User Advocacy Group, Esri Support Services

  41. #41
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    FYI

    I went and created this topic in the ideas post. You can promote it here.

    Please vote we'll get what we need faster. Maybe Denise can do some lobbying as well.

    Thanks

  42. #42
    Daniel Mallett
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    Wink Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by Kopcz1nj View Post
    FYI

    I went and created this topic in the ideas post. You can promote it here.

    Please vote we'll get what we need faster. Maybe Denise can do some lobbying as well.

    Thanks
    @Kopcz1nj thanks for doing this but I think your link doesn't work because you were signed in.

    I got this link by clicking Share on the Ideas page:

    http://ideas.arcgis.com/ideaView?id=087E00000004YOnIAM

  43. #43
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by dmallett View Post
    @Kopcz1nj thanks for doing this but I think your link doesn't work because you were signed in.

    I got this link by clicking Share on the Ideas page:

    http://ideas.arcgis.com/ideaView?id=087E00000004YOnIAM
    Daniel, Thanks for the heads up. I see there's no way to edit my old post so we're stuck with it I guess.

  44. #44
    Jason Warzinik
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Denise and others,

    Question for you in regards to the Lenovo ThinkPads

    We are about to buy a Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Win 8 Pro tablets w/GPS & Mobile broadband to use with ArcGIS Mobile for Windows and want to verify; will the GPS will work via the aforementioned COM port even without an active cellular data service plan? We plan to copy the map cache and sync the features while in the office and use the map in a disconnected mode. How does ArcGIS Mobile work as far as performance? Have you guys been able to test any Windows 8 Pro devices that have the i3, i5, processors vs the Atom?

    Thanks all for your time and advice,

  45. #45
    Geoff Coupe
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by Denise62 View Post
    Esri Support update on Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Windows 8 Pro OS testing:

    there are 2 diff models of Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Win 8 Pro tablets - one w/GPS & Mobile broadband & one without
    Attachment 21723

    Esri Support has both models & you can see in screenshots of expanded Device Manager list that GPS model on left includes Ports (COM & LPT) as we specified during purchasing ThinkPad 2 tablet we needed integrated GPS
    * Sierra Wireless Gobi NMEA GPS connection on COM4
    Attachment 21724
    also listed in Device Manager is Sensors including Broadcom GNSS Gelocation Sensor yet Esri Support hasn't performed testing or further research into Sensors yet

    screenshot below is 2nd ThinkPad 2 tablet we have which doesn't include integrated GPS which is what I expect many of you have as well & which is likely reason you are unable to connect to GPS functionality within ArcPad or ArcGIS for Windows Mobile applications as both ArcPad and ArcGIS for Windows Mobile both state in documentation they require COM port to connect to GPS functionality.
    Attachment 21725


    found similar reports with other GPS software applications & variety of Win 8 Pro tablets, see http://forums.toshiba.com/t5/Satelli...5t/td-p/346208

    Will continue to update with ArcPad & ArcGIS for Windows Mobile testing going forward, as time permits.
    Denise

    linking to related ArcPad Forum thread on similar topic - http://forums.arcgis.com/threads/770...143#post276143
    Pardon me for jumping in to this thread, but I think there is more information that you should be aware of.

    In the US, the Lenovo ThinkPad Tablet 2 model that has Broadband capability is fitted with the Sierra EM7700 - Gobi Wireless device. As your screenshot shows, that device also provides an NMEA stream via a virtual COM port.

    However, in Europe (and possibly elsewhere), Lenovo uses the Ericsson c5621gw hardware for Broadband. See http://support.lenovo.com/en_US/down...DocID=DS033224

    This hardware ONLY supports the Broadband function - it does not supply NMEA info via a virtual COM port. In fact, out of the box, a European ThinkPad Tablet 2 has no COM ports listed in Device Manager.

    In both cases, GPS info is supplied via the Broadcomm chip, but the info is exposed via the Location Provider API. If the GPS application software isn't written to interface to this, but only to the legacy virtual COM ports, then it won't work.

    See also http://gcoupe.wordpress.com/2013/02/...does-it-again/

  46. #46
    Nick Kopczyk
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Quote Originally Posted by jwarzi View Post
    Denise and others,

    Question for you in regards to the Lenovo ThinkPads

    We are about to buy a Lenovo ThinkPad 2 Win 8 Pro tablets w/GPS & Mobile broadband to use with ArcGIS Mobile for Windows and want to verify; will the GPS will work via the aforementioned COM port even without an active cellular data service plan? We plan to copy the map cache and sync the features while in the office and use the map in a disconnected mode. How does ArcGIS Mobile work as far as performance? Have you guys been able to test any Windows 8 Pro devices that have the i3, i5, processors vs the Atom?

    Thanks all for your time and advice,
    I just returned from a field collection in which we used the Lenovo TP2 (3682-22U) Broadband version with no wireless plan. The GPS worked fine. We were using ArcPad but the interface is the same for both programs.

  47. #47
    Tim Wroblewski
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Just wondering if anyone has had any luck with the new Windows 8 Panasonic Toughpad? Does the GPS communicate via a COM port and therefore, allow for communication with ArcGIS for Windows Mobile?

    Thanks,

    Tim

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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    i have a solution for some i use Oziexplorer for my mapping
    it works with Lenovo Thinkpad 2 running Win 8 Pro the software is http://www.oziexplorer.com/
    all i had to do was update my software

    Thank Phillip

  49. #49
    Henrik Svenningsen
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    If it's about getting WIN 8 on a tablet to "see" your GPS, mostly external GPS, you should try FRANSON GPS GATE.

    We use this software (free) on our Samsung SLATE Tablets and it works just splendid....but without it....no GPS connection.

  50. #50
    Jeremy Zimmerman
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    Default Re: Using ArcGIS for Windows Mobile with the Windows sensor/location API

    Unfortunately GPS Gate doesn't actively support Windows 8 yet, it just happens to work a bit with windows 8.

    The problem is, it doesn't work at ALL with internal GPS sensors that give location through the Windows Location API.

    I've contacted the developer and their reply was...

    GpsGate <support@gpsgate.com>
    Apr 3 (7 days ago)

    to me
    Currently GpsGate Client does not support Windows Location API. We will however look into this issue for coming updates.

    Best Regards,
    Johan
    I highly recommend everyone here contact them about your needs, the more they know folks are looking for this as a fix, the more likely they will add support quickly.

    I will mention, I was able to get ArcPad 10.1 to see the GPS sensor a bit using GPS gate and a virtual com port program I found, but it crashed shortly afterwards and I can't get it to come up again.

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